I am going to replace my hot water heater in the next week with a larger one. However, the new one I am going to install is a POWER VENT model. I am aware of the possible problems that I can have with this such as if the electricity goes out. What I am asking is, does anyone have one of these and what types of problems have you encountered?
My FIRST question would be-----------WHY?
Why even go that route? More stuff to fail. More complex and expensive to repair and/or service, etc......
Unless there is a specific reason you are going to that type of a unit, I like keeping things simple.
Also, I guess your area is prone to power outages? You seem a bit concerned in case you lose electric service. Knowing this in advance would deter me from buying this type of HWH.
I personally have not serviced (nor own) a power vented HWH (only a boiler or furnace) but can tell you that unless you really need a power vented unit, try to stay away from them.
The problems I have encountered with power vents outweigh any benefits that I can see. Like I said, I like keeping things SIMPLE.
If you like working under the hood of today's cars versus old school cars with points, rotor, condensor, distributor cap, etc./... I'm sure that you will love a power vent unit. (hehehehe)
Maybe someone out there can offer a different view. How about it guys? Anybody PREFER a power vented unit?
Good luck
Charlie
It's certainly true that there is more stuff to go wrong, and it's harder for anyone other than an HVAC tech trouble-shoot problems. I just had a American Standard Freedom 90 furnace go down at one of my rentals and the tech went right - as in, within 90 seconds - to the problem (binding inducer fan), it might have taken me a while to track that one down.
That said I encounter two situations were power vented water heaters make sense.
1) It's desirable to sidewall vent the appliance.
2) It's desirable to use a CAT IV appliance because it allows installation in closed utility room without combustion air concerns.
Also, in some of the municipalities where I do home inspections here in the Chicago area the building departments are encouraging the installation of direct vent appliances (especially furnaces) in replacements where the existing appliance is drawing combustion air from an unconfined space within the structure because they feels it's safer - they don't require it, but they will tell contractors and homeowners they prefer it.
I was comparing apples to apples. Then I was thrown an orange! I was assuming the application allowed a CHOICE of either design, and YOUR main concern was an electrical outage.
You made no mention of these other concerns and desires (utility room installation, limited combustion air, desired side wall venting). Also you stated that you were going to replace YOUR unit, not one many miles away in a rental.
If you are replacing a unit in a rental apartment then go with the vented design if you want. You will most likely call a tech on those units anyway, I presume.
You are going to pay more for the unit initially so I assume that the cost to purchase and service the equipment is not the major issue. Application is the main concern, not a power failure as initially stated. Right?
As far as YOUR house or unit, since YOU sound like a handy guy (and you have this forum to guide you too!) I suggest a simpler unit to work on so that YOU can fix it instead of the tech. In a HWH I don't believe that there would be substantial short term savings in fuel.
If I had that information from the getgo, perhaps I would have responded this way initially. That is why sometimes we like to SEE the installation and make recommendations based on what we hear and see.
Maybe others have contrasting input? How 'bout it fellas????
Good luck,
Charlie
Sorry about the last post, I thought you were the same guy that made the initial thread. That's what happens keeping these late hours.
However, my opinion stands: Unless the application is best suited for a power vented WH, go conventional.
Charlie
Went ahead with the installation. Here was the scenario. My Brick chimney that goes from the basement, through the first floor (hidden), and through the second floor (exposed) is leaking at the flashing. Since the chimney is only being used to vent my gas hot water heater, I looked into the powervent which would allow me to vent directly out the side of the house. Plus, I can now take out my chimney to the floor of my second level and greatly open up the room in which it was located.
Went ahead and did it this weekend. Had to sweat all new pipes for the new location with acetylene and solder, (copper has gotten expensive). Installed elbows, T's, valves, etc. Had to move gas lines to the new location. Had to run electrical from the circuit breaker to the new location. Had to drill a hole through my exterior wall for the new vent pipe, seal and caulk the hole. All told, took better part of both days, with myself, my father, and brother. Having a plumber come and do the work would have been easy. The hard part was the three of us putting out ideas for each little part of the job (I would do this, I wouldn't do that). All done though
New, Sears Kenmore 50 gal. Powervent water heater: $700
Parts to install new heater: $450
Labor saved by not using a plumbing service: Est. $500 or $600
Spending 19 hours with my dad and brother in my basement: Priceless I guess.
If anyone has any questions about what to do with one of these installations, let me know.
Originally Posted by LinwoodNJ
. Plus, I can now take out my chimney to the floor of my second level and greatly open up the room in which it was located.
Being able to better enjoy the added space is the 'Priceless' part.
BTW: Doesn't this sound like a commercial on TV or something?
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BTW: The price of copper has about doubled within the past 2 years or so. The price does fluctuate a bit, up and down, but I am still sorry that I returned so much copper that I wasn't using for a refund just BEFORE it went up!
Charlie
I regularly remove chimneys and sidewall vent gas appliances at my rental rehabs for exactly the reasons you have mentioned - a major source of roof leaks is eliminated, I no longer have to worry about maintaining the masonry, and I pick up rentable floor space.
It is true, tough, that CAT IV appliances are more expensive and require more service, at one project done in 2005 I have five CAT IV furnaces, THREE have required service this winter (two pressure sensors and a binding inducer fan).
OTOH, the 5 Takagi tankless water heaters - more complicated devices - are so far working perfectly.
I wonder where I can buy Japanese furnaces.
I have so far installed some higher BTU (commercial--Laundromat) wall hung Peerless and they were only about $1,000.00 each (delivered) and 200KBTU+ each, and was able to hook 2 up together with their kit (about $75).
I was wondering about the Tagkagi ones, even though they are more money and less BTUs. They are available on the internet but I can't remember on which site I saw them. You can let us know which ones you like and the advantages/disadvantages you find using them. Just don't make it sound like a commercial (hehehehe).
SPECIAL vent kits are sold separately for these units by Peerless, but I do not know about other brands.
We service guys rather know AHEAD of time if there is a particular benefit that any one of these units may have, or a particular problem too!
The DISADVANTAGE I found with the Peerless wall-hung 200KBTU units was that you can only put 2 together with the kit. If you needed to put 3 or more together, which I would have done 3-4 on this installation, you needed to buy an expensive 'controller' which costs as much or more than one of the units. The customer wanted to 'try' it that way first, then if it was not enough, separate half of the plumbing and install another two units. Good idea from a customer!
Laundromats have easily accessable plumbing so it would by child's play to re-plumb half the store! ONLY the hot would have required it. Ended up it is working fine right now with about 10 washers ever being used at one time. He actually has 20 washers but not as many customers-----yet. The water is not exactly HOT-HOT when all machines are being used together but better than just warm.
I do not know if this is 'customary' with these type of units or not. I do know that the 'link kit' had something to do with 'sharing' one 'brain' and turning both units on at the same time. There was no 'link kit' for linking 3-5 units together but they did offer a 'controller that had 'cute lights' on it and every unit would plug into it via harness.
I guess you haven't had the pleasure of doing a commercial job yet requiring 500KBTUs or more. Let us know.
Charlie (old dog in a new kennel society)
Hello There! I am a newbie here, so I hope that I am posting this right!.
Who I am: A Real Estate Agent
The Problem: The inspector said that while he was inspecting the Brick Chimney that the bricks on the chimney int he attic are deteriorated and thyere are holes to the flue. As a result this condition may allow carbon monozide to enter the home. (there are detectors in the home) The onloy appliance using the chimney is the water heater and he recommends a power vent be installed on the water heater and the chimney by abandoned prior to closing.
I need to know the solution: Is this the best suggestion and is it necessary? What is the estimated costs of doing such a project? If this should be done...does anyone know a realiable plumber to handle the project?
Thank you for your time and I owe you some advice in my field now!!
Tags: power, venting, water, heater, power vented, would have, being used, sound like, water heater, binding inducer
